Thursday’s lineups: Tigers at Yankees

Day off for Miguel Cabrera + another day out for Torii Hunter and Eugenio Suarez = a pieced-together Tigers lineup. Ian Kinsler slots down to Cabrera’s usual third spot in the order, with Rajai Davis leading off and Ezequiel Carrera bumped up to second.

On the Yankees side, Derek Jeter is off for the day game after the night game. Stephen Drew moves over to short, with Brendan Ryan at second.


  1. Rajai Davis, LF
  2. Ezequiel Carrera, CF
  3. Ian Kinsler, 2B
  4. Victor Martinez, DH
  5. J.D. Martinez, RF
  6. Don Kelly, 1B
  7. Nick Castellanos, 3B
  8. Alex Avila, C
  9. Andrew Romine, SS

P: Rick Porcello

YANKEES (career numbers off Porcello)

  1. Brett Gardner, LF (4-for-13, 2 walks, K)
  2. Martin Prado, 3B (1-for-3)
  3. Jacoby Ellsbury, CF (7-for-10, double, 2 HR, walk)
  4. Carlos Beltran, DH (3-for-5, walk)
  5. Chase Headley, 1B (2-for-3, double, HR)
  6. Stephen Drew, SS (1-for-4, HR, 2 walks)
  7. Francisco Cervelli, C
  8. Ichiro Suzuki, RF (9-for-25, 2 doubles, 3 K’s)
  9. Brendan Ryan, 2B (3-for-6, walk, K)

P: Shane Greene


Irony is rampant in baseball. Offense breaks out today.

No bench. So better take care of themselves

How long will they go short on the bench?

At least DH Miggy

Awesome first inning at the plate….9 pitches and 2 strikeouts. P-A -T- H-E-T-I-C Rick will probably have to pitch a shutout in order to give us a chance.

Yikes–looks like it is going to be a very long afternoon. Castellanos won’t even get a foul ball offf this guy judging by the way he screwed around with similar hitters like Davis and Kinsler.
Sure not booking any flights to Detroit just yet.

Maybe too early to tell but it looks like they may be in a hurry to catch the 4:00 stagecoach west to Toronto.

I don’t get it.
-Tigers can’t score runs
-bottom of the lineup
-Yankee infield out of position with Headley & Ryan
-Yankess throwing the ball aro7und
-Romine has speed and can bunt
What does Brad do?
Hit away

To do list, a 3B

A double from a .172 hitter to score a run. So many Tigers with better BA and can do nothing. Sickening.

It amazing isn’t it?

Damn amazing how other teams don’t waste so many opportunities!

Ricky P never seems to get many breaks—but lots of bleeders.
Castellanos (as much as I hate to say it) probably could benefit from a demotion to the minors. There is no way he can hit the ball if he isn’t looking at for one thing. Pulls his head off (as well as dropping his back shoulder). He has to stop killing the ball-even if he does hit it the best he can expect is a towering fly ball to right-center.
He is completely lost and his confidence is waning.
Do I want to see Don Kelly at 3B? No way– but expecting Castellanos to figure it out without hurting the team is unrealistic. At the very least Ausmus should be insisting Joyner fix this pronto.
Romine is our best hitter right now. How absurd is that?

No hitting today either. Think I’m making a mistake (money) by heading up to Toronto.

Guess victor is turning into a piece of crap hitter too …unacceptable

This is probably over…..

This entire team slumping is something that rears its ugly head frequently and not unexpectedly. We’ve been dealing with it for a couple of years now and the contagion generally spreads from the Big Guy downwards.
Victor had a sacfly pitch that he took for a strike before doing what Miggy would have done in the same circumstance.

Porcello got away with pitching to Headley with Drew on deck.

This is unreal. Where is the old Tug McGraw “you gotta believe” mantra?
They are playing with a different mantra right now, kind of like “I can fail worse than you can”.
I haven’t been listening to the radio but I can just imagine Jim Price’s reaction to all this.

Ya he doesn’t sugar coat like Rod and Mario. Last night when I was on my way home Dan and Jim were pretty annoyed by the Tigers and haven’t been for a while.

I fully expect a pseudo rally being ended with a Miggy PH strikeout.

Last outing for Greene
4.2 innings 6 hits 3 runs 96 pitches
5.1 innings 8 hits 3 runs 86 pitches
5.2 innings 5 hits 4 runs 108 pitches

Today 7 innings 4 hits 0 runs 89 pitches ( so far)


this team is constipated…snakebit!

Rick has got to be sick to his stomach and mad as hell. Allowing only one run driven in by a .172 hitter and he is getting no support whatsoever

They need another bat. Where do they put him? JD has made himself replaceable. They wont find a 3b that can hit now that the two best options are with the Yankees: Headley and Prado

He better make Gadner out. The last thing we want is him on base to end another 2B career

Yanks left them loaded when they could have run away with the game. Championship teams take that inning back to the dugout and convert the effort into quality and inspired at bats.

Shane Greene. Anybody remember Alan Ladd and the kid calling him “Shane, Shane.”

On my way to the dentist. Ugh! I won’t be able to watch how it ends.

Rick 109 pitches. He is probably done. Another loss. So now the BP can blow it up or if by some miracle they come back and win, the relief pitcher gets the win. That rule is full of sh*t. 109 pitches deserves a win if his team can pull it out.
However, it doesn’t seem likely when they have only what, 6 runs in 34 innings for this series?

I think part of the reason for this slump is simply not playing with any energy. By choice, I might add.
You play with energy and you make things happen, you elevate team spirit, you provide better opportunities.
How often have the Tigers attempted to stal a base lately? Other than VMart, JD and Suarez have you noticed anyone trying to steal a base?
Any reason why the speedster Carrera not be given the go with Kinsler up?
Had he stolen a base on any of the 4 previous pitches Kinsler’s bloop would have scored him.
Rajai never attempts any more, Kinsler either. Brad is falling into a trap of thinking conservatve ball will provide him with a big hitter getting a big hit. The result is they are putting little pressure on the defense or the pitcher choosing to have the pitcher have his way with our hitters instead.

Which Mart is gonn hit into a DP?

Sorry I ….don’t claim to be a genius but wouldn’t it make more sense to let JD hit? So if miggy fails which I expect now there’s nothing on the bench

So damn predictable. Miggy made about 180,000 for that incredible waste of an at bat.

Brad just made a complete bone-head play here.
Miggy is a real DP candidate.
Kelly and Casty coming up are far better guys to PH for.

There is no award for bad managing.
Everyone in Tigerdom knew Miggy would fail utterly in that position at this point in time.
He has less confidence then Castellanos has

Really, I think Miggy is an OK hitter, you know with that triple crown thing, batting title last year, etc. Sometime guys don’t perform. Move on. It was the right move, just didn’t work out.

come on guys, hit the freaking ball already. Don’t get at all pinch hitting for VMart – guy hits from both sides of the plate.

JD. Victor was walked ( IBB in disguise)

6 for 15 during the series

Thanks, my bad. Was listening on the radio and heard Martinez – at least now I am not so mad, thought he was crazy to take VMArt out! I guess that is what Miggy is paid to do, but not the Miggy that is playing right now – he has to get that danger back.

If I’m in the Tiger rotation I am totally demoralized. A pitcher should have a sense of excitement when stepping to the mound in the 1st inning, not fear or resignation.

Maybe DD should go to the waiver wire and find another starting pitcher.

Wow, we were lucky to win the one game. Bad week in NY.
We pitched very well so if they keep that up, we’re good to go. Unless you think the club will hit like this the rest of the year. Realistically, I mean, not emotionally.

He is not the answer but:
Made it to FTF for @MudHens v. Lehigh Valley. Andy Dirks is HERE for rehab, but not in lineup. Jim Johnson joins Hens tomorrow.

What a royal embarassment! I apologize to Rick for the disrespect shown to him by his joke of an offensive lineup. This reminds me of the 2001-2004 brand of ball.
1. Rick is a gamer!
2. Coke still has some fizz.
3. Fourth straight extra quality start leads to nothing.

Nothing unexpected at Yankees Stadium. And now the Jays and Anibal is not the best match for them

4 games against re-tread Yankee pitchers. 39 innings, 6 runs, 24 hits, 1 error. That’s 1 run every 6.5 innings. Illitch is paying $ millions for that? DD trades 2 players for one outstanding pitcher? All 4 starters have QS? The only win was due to Romine and Avila HR’s? Nothing seems to help. KC is in the hunt again.

By the way, Fister is now 11-3.

this is why:
“Lowest hard-hit rate among MLB starters

Chris Sale 8.8%
Garrett Richards 9.5%
Cole Hamels 9.6%
Doug Fister 10.2%
Cobb & Wacha 10.3%”
Mark Simon ESPN NY

What really matters:
“Doug Fister has a 2.49 ERA this season, 2.15 if you take out his 1st start. He made nice transition to NL”
I like the Price trade. I think is the best since Miguel for nothing.
And the Fister for Ray was the worst ever

Yep, the Price trade was probably a really good move. It just was a move that wouldn’t have had to been made if the ridiculously bad Fister deal hadn’t gone down.

I am thankful we have a GM that can make up for a truly epic clusterf*** of a mistake with a nice deal like the Price deal. That being said, it was still an epic clusterf*** of a mistake. Long term I don’t think we will miss AJ because his defense has disappeared and his bat was never anything special. But Smyly had some potential, so that could end up hurting. Or not. Only time will tell.

Yet they are still winning and scraping along and still winning meanwhile the bums for the tigers are playing like they could give a crap! And no I don’t believe the Yankee pitchers were just that good. They were a with the exception of a crappy Kuroda a bunch a retreads that nobody wanted. It’s downright pathetic.

Another good outing for Ricky today . No run support once again for him . Things will not get any easier in Toronto and Pittsburgh .

I understand what you are saying Rich, realistically can you expect the team to start hitting again for sure, but how long before they go into more painful slumps again? Can they afford to have it happen at all again in 2014?
It’s all too frequent and predictable.
I also think it will felt to be very humiliating for JD to have anyone, even the great Miguel Cabrera, PH for him in the 9th inning.
I think it was a very bad idea to do that. Kelly, yes, Castellanos, yes, Avila or Romine yes. I hope he has not lost something with JD

I unscientifically figure that Miggy is 40% of the offense, perhaps more. With him having physical ailments, runs are hard to come by. These speed guys do have to attempt steals even if it’s not an ideal situation for them. T. Hunt was a huge loss to the offense these last three games.
When the offense struggles to this degree, you can kind of see where Dirks actually could be of help. Almost anyone would be of help.

Even my sick aunt might do better . Leadership is lacking both on field and in the dugout . I also wondered why their running game has stalled out .

And to be fair, when the Tigers did hit the ball hard this week, it was caught nearly every time. A few more in the seats would have been uncatchable, but that didn’t happen. Avila and Romine led the “offensive charge” in NY.

Very pathetic offense since the A/S break! 2 series wins vs. lowly D-Backs and the Rox. Otherwise against CLE 1-3; Halos 1-3; Pale Hose 1-2 and Yanks 1-3 in a very UGLY 3-week stretch. I’m tired of weak offensive streaks at the cost of Quality starts.

Avila & Romine led the charge because they are LH and that ballpark was designed for left handed hitters. Neither one of those homeruns would have made it to the warning track in Comerica, I don’t believe. It’s not like NY scored that many runs off our starters either. Jeter is still a force on that team with a will to win it puts us to shame. I’m tired of hearing about him, but they won 5 World Series. What are they going to do if Miguel keeps going on like this? What will it be like in 5 more years.

Let the rumors begin!!

Unless there is a big left handed hitter floating around on waivers, this is something we just need to weather. Miggy and VMart are not hitting much, so we are going to struggle. We are no longer a mash team (Peralta, Fielder) but a team built on pitching, and 2 great hitters. We are going to slump.

I do agree that we need to get more aggresive on the basepaths.

Maybe AJax was more important than we all thought?

I think Carerra will more than make up for the loss of AJ. Certainly getting Price will.
Carerra has not been “infected” yet and actually shows some potential.
The real problems are, as stated by portwine, but also with Ian Kinsler.
Leadership is needed here and those three are not really inspiring anybody. Kinsler is a rock on the infield but pulling 3 balls foul down the line every at bat is only getting him in the hole.
I said earlier that Casty could benefit from a couple of weeks in Toledo. I do believe that. He is only going to press and make things worse. He needs to restore his confidence.
Brad needs to energize his club. Let’s start to hit & run, steal bases, bunt, lay off the breaking balls—something—anything.

The whole team needs to go to Tolefo then.

I can hear Nero fiddling—actually saw him in the box seats next to our dugout.

The dentist who worked on me today was at the game in New York when Scherzer pitched. Her family are Tiger fans but her son loves Jeter so they are trying to visit different stadiums when he plays. Nice, huh?

Kinsler career with half of the games at a hitter friendly park:
273/ 349 /.454/.804
with the Tigers
285 /.317/.430/.747
So far, better ave big drop in OBP and a little lower slg% .
2? days off. Yes, he stopped hitting after his first day off. But he needs some rest.

Victor is hitting , not with unusual power of the half season but his timing is back. Just not coming enough with runners on. Usually he leads off inning, that is ,the few times Miguel does not

Call it a career:
Wagner:”Turning to @MudHens baseball, Dirks not in lineup because of hamstring problems. MAY not be ready until Saturday. #Tigers”

KC wins——2.5 back now. Creeping in there. Tigers might want to to get their heads out of their collective butts!

There’s a chance that you might end up with just a guy on third when he hits for Kelly,” Ausmus said. “I’d rather have two runners on with Miggy hitting than one. So I figured go to our best hitter right now with two runners on as opposed to wait and see what happens.”
Agree, you go with your horse.
JD, 3 for last 23

One last thing, better to lose now when they can do something than later

That was the right time to PH Miggy. Runners on first and second, they can’t walk him. It was a smart move and the best one available.

Loved/agreed with the decision, hated the result. That is why they play the games.

Baserunning? Outs trying to advance 44 , third worst. CS 34 second worst.PO 8. 7th: 85 Total Outs by (mostly reckless) running .Bonus: Outs at home: 15 . Third.
Xtra base % 39. below average. They better forget of running.

I politely disagree. Miggy could have been saved for Kelly or even Casty.. He has been struggling as much as anybody in the lineup. He is a DP in waiting and has been hitting into them at alarming rates and at often at the worst possible times.
JD hits a ground ball he at least has a CHANCE of beating out the relay and putting a man on 3rd with 1 out.
I hear a lot of an open base and putting Miggy on. so be it. That outcome would have been much better than the one that we got and that many of us figured would result.
If JD hits into a force you then have a 1st and 3rd and can put Miggy in there–if they walk him you now have bases loaded with 1 out. No pitcher likes to pitch with the bases loaded.
If JD whiffs or flys out you still have Miggy for Kelly with 1st & 2nd.
I understand what Brad was trying to do and fans agreeing with it,
Not for me though.


I must admit Jim would never have said this: ““Not that it’s likely, but if J.D. hits into a triple play, all of sudden we’ve left our best hitter on the bench,” Ausmus said. “And we try to avoid doing that.”

From The Detroit News:

I guess someone will have to calculate the odds of Miggy driving in a run vs hitting into a DP vs whoever hit after Miggy being successful in that one-out bases loaded situation.
I thought it was a good move at the time he made it.

Reference…calculating the odds of Miggy hitting into DP’s….I watch just about
every game and from what I’ve seen he does it quite frequently lately…doesn’t
seem to get the ball up in the air anymore in key situations. I thought It was a dumb move by Ausmus…it de-fused DA key hitter… what was wrong with a sac ?..Who is AUSMUS LISTENING TO IN THE DUG-OUT? THAT WAS TERRIBLE,AND HASTY DECISION ON HIS PART OR WHO HE WAS LISTENING TO.?…..


A telling story about coaching
Nothing new. Players dismissing coach and managers is old like baseball ( 1968, Mayo Smith?)

Lineup at TOR: Davis 8, Kinsler 4, Cabrera 3, V. Martinez DH, Hunter 9, J. Martinez 7, Avila 2, Castellanos 5, Suarez 6. Sanchez starting.

Nice to see Suarez and Torii back. Usually I dread seeing a knuckleballer, but maybe that will get the Tiger hitters out their rut. Think guys have been pressing too much (esp. Nick and JD. Swinging at balls too much)

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