Monday: Tigers vs. Twins

Magglio Ordonez was in the lineup for the rainout last night, but he isn’t in there today. With the doubleheader, Leyland was not going to start Magglio both games, instead giving Clete Thomas a shot in the opener after his nice game over the weekend.

More interesting might be the fact that Gerald Laird will probably catch both games. He’s in the lineup for the opener to work with Rick Porcello, which has been a good combination, and Laird has been working with Justin Verlander for all but one start this year.


  1. Granderson, CF
  2. Polanco, 2B
  3. Thomas, RF
  4. Cabrera, 1B
  5. Huff, DH
  6. Guillen, LF
  7. Laird, C
  8. Inge, 3B
  9. Santiago, SS

P: Rick Porcello


  1. Denard Span, CF
  2. Orlando Cabrera, SS
  3. Joe Mauer, C
  4. Jason Kubel, RF
  5. Michael Cuddyer, 1B
  6. Delmon Young, LF
  7. Jose Morales, DH
  8. Matt Tolbert, 3B
  9. Nick Punto, 2B

P: Nick Blackburn


I give up.

I think they understand that this series may bring them clinch. Let’s not to blame Leyland decisions right now, just give him credit and support our guys. Come on, Tigers! It’s time to do or to die.

Who can take this lineup seriously? If the Red Sox can drop David Ortiz from the three-hole because of a lack of production, why can’t Jim Leyland bury Clete Thomas at the bottom of the order? He has no business batting in third in ANY Major League lineup, let alone Detroit’s.

Rich, we thought they will lose in Metrodome with Nate on the mound, but they won. We also thought that Rays will sweep us, but we swept them. I read many times to trade Magglio, but now he is one of our best hitters. Don’t give up! GO TIGERS!

Stranding a lead off double – not a way to start.

I’m not giving up on the game, I’m giving up on Leyland ever running a proper lineup out there. That first inning was a perfect example. Thomas doesn’t take his walk, they pitch around Cabrera and Huff bounces out weakly. This lineup doesn’t work. Hopefully we’ll be lucky.

I totally support the Tigers, but I also question having Thomas in the 3 spot. Minny has Joe Mauer and we have Clete instead of Maggs. I don’t get it either, but maybe they will surprise us. Maggs will probably play tonight, or later in this game. Thomas might be defensive replacement for tonight’s game. What a great day for baseball! It’s so exciting. Sure hope we win.

Well two innings down. It was nice to see Brandon get that hit. Would of like to have seen them do a little more with the base runners they have had, 4 batters already stranded.

Porcello has got to learn how to field his position. Two balls hit off of him and to Brandon. Yikes.

It’s easy to say in hindsight, but I think Lamont has to send Clete home on Cabrera’s hit.

Oh crap – I cannot believe that they let these guys wiggle out of another jam. Not liking this at all.

Tell me, please, why do they hit first pitches? Why don’t to wait two balls and not to try to adjust for pitcher?

Unfortunately, it was predicted😦

That is what I like Tigers stranding more base runners. Polanco has not been good at the plate today. Funny so far today the best hitters have been those that you wouldn’t expect., Inge Laird, Santiago and Granderson

Amazing how that works a Sac Fly and an RBI???? I am not sure that the Tigers even know what that is. We only know how to squander our opportunities. Sickening. Lets hope that it doesn’t come back to haunt them today, as it has on so many other days. Come on Tigers.

Well now going into the 6th inning, we had our opportunities to get many more runs against Blackburn, he is looking stronger the longer this game goes on. Where as on the other hand Porcello is looking more hittable as the game goes on. I fear the Tigers blew their chance at winnig this game.

I fear too. But! But the game isn’t over. GO TIGERS!

Your best hitter should be batting third. Maggs won a batting title and he is not playing the first game? I wish I was watching on TV. We need a real manager.
Go Tigers! –Dave

I also don’t understand why Maggs isn’t in this game. Huff should be on the bench and Maggs should be in.

Polanco not on his game today. He has been horrible at the plate, and now he flubs that nearly routine ground out to second.

Well here we go to the 8th. Did I mention those stranded runners are looming very large. Miner came in and also did a nice job. Can we please get some runs now???

Atta boy Zach – way to pitch.
Just got a radio station to work on my radio at work, listening to the game is making me not work as hard as I should though!

Miner just came through huge in the biggest spot of the year so far. Now lets get some runs!!

Excellent work by Miner! Porcello also was very good. Tigers, we need to score! GO!

does Huff have dirty pictures of Leyland or something? Cuz I have no idea the logic of batting him 5th……

Terrific a guy hitting in the 190’s gets a lead off double. SWEET.

Sweet – play there Lyon and Laird

My God, I thought we had it won there with Santiago’s hit. Another inning of torture. I can’t this, it’s killing me.

what a dispicable way to lose this game.

what a despicable way to lose the game..
let’s just leave him in there to get torched some more.. 1 inning and he gives up 3 hits, 2 wild pitches, almost costs us the game in the 9th and costs us the game in the 10th..

my god, i can’t believe he has left him in.. jim leyland, you sir, are an *******.

if these are the bats that come to play tonight, we can kiss that game goodbye too along with our division lead.

gamecast says we have a 13.42 percent chance of scoring 2+ runs this inning, more like a 13 percent chance we’ll get 1 guy on base.

wow.. if jim/lyon hadnt totally F***ED us in the top of the 10th, perhaps we’d have just walked off.

Oh Ramon that was so good, I cannot believe that he caught that ball. Unfreaking believable. Stranded runner after stranded runner.

crap lead off hit by Span. Can we please just get through this inning.

Ramon hit good, but was a little bit unlucky

This is the end

Great job Lyon – we will probably lose this game because of a stinking wild pitch and the Tigers inability to score with runners in scoring position. Lyon has done a good job almost all season and he fails us now. CRAP CRAP CRAP.

Game over – we can’t score against Nathan.

WHY, WHY,WHY was Lyon left in the game? Come on JL, this is important! Now we need 2 runs to tie it!

Dear Mr. Dombrowski:

How is all that money you spent on Gary Sheffield working out for you? You could have paid for a decent young hitter with all that money. Instead, you paid for a washed up malcontent that contributed nothing to the Tigers. In fact, it is no coincidence that the Tigers made a pennant run the year before he was there and the year after he left. Your ridiculous attachment to members of the champion Marlins team resulted in two terrible trades, one for Sheffield and the for Renteria. The latter trade resulted in you giving away a fine young pitcher. As the Tigers continue to lose low-scoring games with the third-highest (I believe) payroll in baseball, thank yourself for the lack of hitting the Tigers possess.

Rod seriously can you gush over the Twins anymore than you already have today???? Seriously

I agree that Lyon should not have been left in the game. However, I also would not have brought in Miner and would not have let him pitch a second inning. I suspect that if many others posting on this blog are truthful, that was the belief they also possessed. Leyland just doesn’t have many offensive weapons to use. Giving up one run to the Twins over nine innings at home should produce a win.

if the tigers do not win tonight, this race is over. twins are in.

Of course, the Tigers get a home run with nobody on base and it does only a little to help their cause.

I still think they can win tonight and I still believe they can win the division. However, the hitting on this team is often terrible.

It is sad to see a great effort by Porcello wasted.

Beginning of the end. I hate to say it, but the Twins will make the playoffs. Thanks Jim!

What do you mean he doesn’t have offensive weapons? Ordonez’s .297 (.379 since August 1st) was on the bench. The key to a good offense is grouping what weapons you have together. Putting Miguel Cabrera on an island like Leyland keeps doing (between Thomas and Huff) is just plain dumb.

Rich, looks like you will be saving your money. I just got my tickets today and now I am hoping to see a nice size debit on my card in the near future.

Oh, I can’t even write what I’m thinking. Just so disgusted and disappointed. Leland made me feel sick to my stomach today.

The Tigers completely made fools out of themselves today. How many times has this played out this year, the pitcher, pitches his tail off. The hitters have many opportunities to manufacture a few runs early in a game. Well the opposing pitcher settles down and bang – you miss your opportunity and you lose the game. Polanco, Huff and lets not forget about those two wild pitches sunk this team. Twins are playing better than they have all year and the Tigers are melting under the pressure again. SLIP SLIDING AWAY RIGHT OUT OF THE POST SEASON.


As usual, we missed too many opportunities.

I don’t get it. Why does JL feel like he needs to continue to play guys that we traded for, even when they don’t contribute? He keeps running Huff out there when he’s done nothing. He kept pitching Washbum until he physically couldn’t pitch, even though he was horrible in all but 1 or 2 starts.
Add to that his stupid lefty-righty fixation, and you have an explanation for why the Tigers haven’t run away with the Central. I hope the Twins lose in the first round.

Today’s game was lost in the first three innings. After that, I felt it was a matter of time. I got a temporary boost when Punto bunted into the DP and I thought Santiago had won it for us, only to be disappointed again. I should have stuck to my original mindset.
This is the kind of thing I foresaw that led to that gloomy Sunday night prediction. I don’t say that to make myself look good, I’m just saying that the Twins are so much better than the Tigers, it isn’t even close. It doesn’t matter how good our starting pitchers are if we can’t score runs.
It appears that many of us have nailed down the problem, and it’s the manager. That line about Huff having dirty pictures of Leyland is familiar, because a lot of folks said the exact same thing about Neifi Perez in 2006. The problem is, JL wanted both his rotation and lineup set for the final month. Why that was so important I don’t know, other than to save him from having to think too much, but the end result is the chronic use of a lineup that doesn’t work. You don’t put your worst hitter in the 5-hole behind your best hitter. I can’t believe JL is that dumb, and it just plays into the hands of the opposing manager. To top it off, he sticks with this lineup to……what…….prove he’s right?
I shouldn’t need to state that I’m a Tigers fan and supporter. Not after all the posts I’ve made here the past four years, all the traveling around the country I’ve made to see them play, not after attending spring training every year. It’s always been my team and this guy and his Pittsburgh cronies are messing it up. I don’t know if I can do another year of Jim Leyland. And I stick by that even if we win the World Series this year.
Afterthought: next July, maybe the fans shouldn’t be screaming to make a trade. Deadline and waiver deals rarely work out for teams, and they never do for us.

Leyland is not a manager. He is just the manager of the Tigers. Jim, throw away the book and get with the times.
How come all of us bloggers see it. Why don’t you read what we have to say? Oh yeah, you do not know how to use a computer! Well, I think JV will throw a shut out tonight. We will win the next 3! Go Tigers!

I understand you. But it’s only the beginning. Yes, it was very disappointed beginning, but I want to believe that we’ll beat Duensing and Pavano_or_Baker. Something should be changed. Tonight we’ll have Maggs in lineup. So I wish this team come back and start scoring well.

I did NOT say Leyland “doesn’t have offensive weapons”. I said he “doesn’t have many offensive weapons to use”. I stand by that statement and it is correct.

As far as Magglio versus Clete. Magglio has a .297 batting average and a .402 slugging percentage. Clete has a .243 batting average and a .390 slugging percentage. In 438 at bats, Magglio has 42 RBI’s. In 267 at bats, Clete has a 39 RBI’s.

The Tigers have a poor offense. Thank Dave Dombrowski for that fact. He wasted millions of dollars on Gary Sheffield and got nothing. For all that money and three young pitchers, he could have a gotten a decent young hitter.

Happ_buck, my question about Washburn is this. Why didn’t the Tigers know about his injury situation before they traded for him? His injury issued did not begin during his time with the Tigers.

Sklant, I thought we were facing Cy Blackburn today the way we hit. The Tigers could have Walter Johnson or Christy Matthewson pitching and it wouldn’t help.

Porcello did everything that was asked of him and probably more. This is just a team that 8 games out of 10 is inept. They every few weeks will shock you but, this is the team that we have had all year. The real thing here is that the Twins are playing a heck of a lot better than they have all year. Until a week ago they hadn’t even won 5 games in a row. This shouldn’t be shocking me but it is.

The difference between Maggs and Clete you ask? Maggs is not, Clete is not. Huff is ice. Use anybody but him for a DH.

That’s is supposed to say Maggs is “hot”. Sure hope he is tonight.

I have/had no objection to playing Magglio in the first or the second game. The time to bench Magglio was when it could have saved the Tigers 18 million dollars. Magglio, though, has even in this hot stretch for him been generally a failure with runners on base. Overall, with 71 more at bats than Clete, Magglio has only 3 more RBI’s. Magglio may have been the right choice today. However, it is not as though Leyland is playing Clete Thomas with Ty Cobb on the bench.

I have/had no objection to playing Magglio in the first or the second game. The time to bench Magglio was when it could have saved the Tigers 18 million dollars. Magglio, though, has even in this hot stretch for him been generally a failure with runners on base. Overall, with 71 more at bats than Clete, Magglio has only 3 more RBI’s. Magglio may have been the right choice today. However, it is not as though Leyland is playing Clete Thomas with Ty Cobb on the bench.

Ordonez has a better average with runners on (.337 to .252) and runners in scoring position (.282 to .273) than Thomas this season.
Also, my point was Thomas should not be batting third. When each of them have batted third this year, Ordonez is at .301/.366/.351 to Thomas’ .206/.301/.310. Ordonez blows him away in on base percentage and the idea is to put runners on base for the cleanup man, hence the name “cleanup.” Rich said it earlier “That first inning was a perfect example. Thomas doesn’t take his walk, they pitch around Cabrera and Huff bounces out weakly. This lineup doesn’t work.”

Personally, I think we’re going to end up playing a 163rd game in the Metrodome. Can you hear the evil laughter in the background?

owen2- I think the Tigers probably did know about Washbum’s knee when they traded for him! Or else somebody wasn’t telling the truth (either Washbum said his knee was OK, or the Mariners didn’t tell them about it). That’s why I’m so frustrated with Dumbrowski. He’s made so many wasted trades that it isn’t funny anymore.

Here is what it comes down to folks – – –
Twins in the last 26 games are playing .653 ball
Tigers in the last 26 games are playing .538 ball
Twins team batting average last 30 days .284
Tigers team batting average last 30 days .279
Twins have left 189 runners on base
Tigers have left 226 runners on base
Twins have scored 125 runs in last 30 days
Tigers have scored 128 runs in the last 30 days.
Twins pitching staffs ERA last 30 days 3.46
Tigers pitching staff’s ERA last 30 days 4.92
Twins pitching staff has given up 93 runs 89 of them earned
Tigers have given up 134 runs and 131 of them earned
Twins pitching has been a whole lot better than it has all year, and ours is tanking. We have actually scored more runs but we are giving up more runs. Is it any wonder the Twins have caught up. Frankly I have said it a couple of times we aren’t playing a whole lot different than all year, but the Twins are playing out of their minds.

I think our bad spell after the Tampa series caused the Twins to believe they could catch us, and they’ve performed accordingly. They looked at those seven head to heads and thought “opportunity.” If this ends badly, the season will have been lost during the KC/Toronto/KC stretch of games.
The frustating part is that, even if we pull this out, we’ll probably lose any advantage we might have had in the Yankee series. You can bet NY will choose the start date based on which starters are available against them.
If you really want to tear your hair out, you can go back over the season and contemplate games we didn’t win. Any of the Willis starts? Any of the Washburn starts? Bonderman’s premature start in Chicago? The game in Boston where Porcello was booted? The flyball in the dome? Any game where Huff killed our chances? The blown games by an injured Zumaya? Tough as it is, every single game counts in the end, from April to September.

JL said he would be using his old tried and tested for the home stretch. Start doing it Jim and plug those 3 and 5 holes now. Our lineup regardless should be:
Raburn/Huff with pitcher
Laird (one game off to end)
Ramon/Everett with Ramon at 7
We can still do this provided the bullpen holds. Again, JL has to act early and decisively rather than holding on for the best when clearly a pitcher is out of sorts like Lyon was today.
JL is showing his age – good managing takes courage and you get no second chances in the last week of the season.

Aslosser, as I have already said, I have/had not objection to playing Magglio over Clete in the lineup in the first or second game. Additionally, I never expressed an opinion about whether Clete should bat third.

Clete was 1 for 3 today. The Tigers only had seven hits. There certainly wasn’t much hitting going on by almost anyone in the lineup. Nothing particularly atypical about.

Your initial response to my comment was to completely mischaractize what I said. You stated “What do you mean he doesn’t have offensive weapons?”. Of course, I never said Leyland doesn’t have offensive weapons. I said he doesn’t have many offensive weapons and I am right about that.

The Tigers don’t have many quality hitters. That is the fault of Dave Dombrowski who wasted millions of dollars and young prospects on Gary Sheffield and wasted money and prospects on Edgar Renteria.

Ah yes, Owen, the ill fated attempt to re-create the 1997 Florida Marlins.
Dave, I don’t want to see Huff at all. I’ll take Raburn over him regardless of who’s pitching. BTW, if you want a good hitter in the 6-hole, it should be Santiago. The numbers don’t lie. And he’d have won us that game today if Gardenhire hadn’t used Gomez to pinch run, thus inadvertantly setting up his outfield to make two important catches.

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