Guillen fighting sore shoulder

guillen.jpgWhile the Tigers certainly have plenty of examples of a newly-struggling offense, Carlos Guillen has seemingly been slumping nearly all season. Even after ending an 0-for-12 slump with a second-inning single, he struck out twice on the night for a 1-for-4 outing that merely raised his average to .200.

His sore right Achilles tendon raised questions whether he was hobbled at the plate, but Guillen says it doesn’t bother him when he’s batting. At this point, he said, it’s getting better, including in the field. But that doesn’t mean he isn’t battling injury.

Guillen said after Monday’s game that he’s been fighting a sore left right shoulder that has lingered for a few weeks. He said he hurt it crashing into the left-field fence at Seattle’s Safeco Field during a game in mid-April. He hasn’t had it examined yet, but said he will “soon” if it continues to trouble him.

“It’s a little sore, tight,” Guillen said.

The problem, looking at the roster, is that the Tigers don’t have much roster flexibility if Leyland or the medical staff eventually need to rest him a few days. Josh Anderson could slot into left field fine, especially now that the Tigers will face some right-handed starters. But with an eight-man bullpen likely to stick for at least the next week, sitting Guillen would leave Detroit with just two available players on the bench, one of them backup catcher Dane Sardinha.

If Guillen did need to rest more than a few games, it wouldn’t be a surprise to see the Tigers in a roster squeeze, possibly forced to either put Guillen on the disabled list for roster flexibility or to go to seven relievers and call up another position player. It would give the Tigers the extra bat, but it would also allow them to bring up another bat from Triple-A Toledo to plug into the lineup that might give a spark.


*whisper* Wilkin Ramirez

What? Who said that?

Guillen is done. He cant play in the infield anymore and in the outfield he cant catch anything except line drives hit directly at him. Arm strengh, well below average at least.
So we have another DH hitting .200 with no power. At least Sheffield used to work the counts, Guillen is swinging at he first pitch he sees. Why we send Larish to the minors? For Rapada? Does not make any sense for me

I love Carlos Guillen….but I think we all can see that his body is breaking down…..time to sit him and let him heal….bring up one of the kids because our outfield corners are way too slow…balls that should be caught are falling in….thank God we have Curtis in center..otherwise it would be a total disaster in the outfield.

Without out Sheffield….we need a batter batting third willing to help work the count. Batting Magglio third is a bad decision. How many times does he swing at the very first pitch and bounce into an inning killing double play. At least Sheffield worked the count and sometimes took a walk. I suggest that we bat Guillen third {when healthy} or someone that is willing to look at a few pitches and try to get on base.

What happened to Polanco going to right field….ever since he talked to his buddy from St. Louis…he has been pulling the ball instead of trying to advance the runner. We don’t have the plate discipline……let Cabrera drive in the runs….

This is so frustrating….you can almost predict what’s going to happen….Granderson gets on….Polanco tries to pull the ball and pops up….Magglio bounces into a double play on the first pitch he sees…next inning Cabreara hits a solo shot…..duh…………..

Why are we still experimenting with Ryan Raburn….lets stop the madness…..what does he do well????

I haven’t seen him do anything well …….ever……

We talk about the kids in Toledo….bring them up…..let Magglio DH……get him out of the outfield…..lets catch some of these balls instead of watching them drop in and guys going for 2.

Guillen and Magglio in the outfield…makes our outfield defense probably the worst in the AL.

We are hurting our pitchers……at the very worst….pull these guys out of the field after 5 or 6 innings and put in some defense for the late innings. Guillen and Magglio aren’t going to make any great catches nor throw anyone out. Their bats are good and I think that we have one maybe two more good years from both of them. But we had better work on getting some help. I like our infield as long as they know their roles and copy what Minnesota and KC are doing…playing small ball. Our only patient hitter is Granderson…..How many times we see him work a count as compared to the rest of the lineup. To me he is our only player worthy of all star credentials ….along with of course MC.

I am blown away with Rodney so far. Wow…he finally gets it. Throwing strikes instead of trying to throw thru a brickwall works. Hats off to pitching coach Knapp. Seay…Zumaya…Rodney…and the kid Ryan are making others jealous. Not so sure what to do with Robertson and Lyon. We need Thames back to hit or get someone who is a professional hitter. Right now….we have no one that scares anyone.

Leyland had better use the hit and run everytime Magglio comes up …cause everyone knows that he is swinging at the first pitch he sees and 9 times out of 10 …its going to be a one hopper to short or third for a double play. Polanco needs to realize he is not going to be a deep ball hitter…..hit singles….get on base….get some walks….advance the runner….bunt………he is doing the opposite of these things….WHY.????????????

We need patient batters….McClendon…help us….I almost can predict what’s going to happen. I was frustrated last year….I watched every game….every inning….I am not going to put myself through this again this year…..

No need to “re-create the wheel”. Look at the successful teams…Boston; NY; LA Angels; Twins….

These teams have such patience….at the plate. They all take the extra base….They work the counts….by the 5th inning….the opposing pitcher has thrown 90 plus pitches….they all take their walks….they hit the mistake pitches and hit them hard.

We don’t do that at all. I hate this! No way should Liriano have shut us down like that. Most of his pitches were in the dirt. Don’t we study film? Don’t we know his tendencies. Sure he was bound to win one soon…..but did it have to be last night ….in our park????

I like that….whisper Wilkin Ramirez LOUDER!!!

Does JL ever seriously talk to his players about how they are performing? How does it take over two weeks to come out that Carlos now has another injury problem. Or is JL the only one not seeing his declining power, timing and patience, on top of his slow hobbling, poor arm and generally lost in LF.
It makes me laugh (or cry) that they chose not to play Sheff at LF or RF out of concern of reinjury despite his clear frustration and substandard performance in the DH role day after day.
JL has to start managing by his gut instinct rather than the conservative approach he is adopting. The horse has usually bolted by the time any changes are made.
If Anderson remembers what a bat looks like, he has to be given an extended opportunity to become the permanent LF. Wilkin Ramirez is too green and not ready. Larish would be the only offense worth bringing back at this stage but would need more playing time than what they were able to provide last time. is likely available.
JL looked like he was trying to extend Jackson’s outing as he lacks confidence in the bullpen outside of Seay, Zoom and Rodney. Perry had better command last night including his off speed pitches so hopefully his on the job development will come through sooner rather than later.

I lost my first attempt to post this morning. The differing management of Sheff and Carlos is either hypocritical and/or illogical.

I think the answer is Josh Anderson in left field. The kid brings speed to the lineup and that creates another element for the Tigers offense which needs something.
If Anderson plays everyday they may want to put him at the leadoff spot and move Granderson into a more RBI friendly spot since he’s been jacking homers lately. By putting Anderson up top, he gets on, steals second, Polanco moves him over and he’s sittin’ on third with one out and that gives them an easy run scoring opportunity even with a groundout.
Hopefully, Anderson gets a full-time look.

Well regarding Guillen, from what I have actually seen it isn’t that he isn’t hitting the ball hard, I have been at a few games where he has hit the ball right on the screws and literally they are right at someone. I was actually thinking if he didn’t hit them so hard it might just fall in. But if he is really hurt they probably should just put him on the DL and let him rest.
It is an interesting situation about how you do bring up. Brent Clevlen can smack the ball and can field really well, so?? But I was looking at Ramirez’s stats, that dude can steal a lot of bases what did I see 10 or 11?? But can he hit big league pitching. And someone said why did they send Larish down? Well he wasn’t getting at bats and when he was getting at bats he wasn’t doing well.
I don’t know the answer?? But what I do know is that getting 4 or 5 hits a game usually isn’t going to win you any ball games. But I do agree that I think there should be a change in the lineup. Anderson first, Polanco, Granderson Cabrera, Ordonez and so on. Because it isn’t working now and frankly I am shocked Leyland hasn’t shaken it up a little.

I like that idea. Leadoff Anderson and move Granderson to #3 spot. Its time for Grandy to produce from that spot. Put Guillen on indefinite DL, the guy is always limping around and looked like a little leaguer in LF last night. There is definitely comparison with Guillen and Shef – Leyland keeps hoping G will majically heal and hit the ball like he “used to”. JL is probably regretting not sac bunting with Laird last night; no outs w/guys on 1st & 2nd – perfect ttime to play small ball and get Jackson some run support. Oh well, live 65 years and learn…..

It doesn’t appear you can play Guillen in the field at all. He’s constantly injuring something. Here we had this extensive discussion on tendon injuries and the guy is playing with a bad shoulder. That explains the pain on his face last night.
Without Guillen, you have no choice but to change the hitting order, since no one will pitch to Cabrera without a threat behind him. I don’t believe other teams see Inge as a threat yet, and I wouldn’t want to put that pressure on Brandon. Plus I like him downstairs in the order. The only workable solution is the Anderson-Polanco-Granderson lineup many of us have been advocating for some time now. You drop Maggs to 5th. He still has the reputation and may even benefit from the change and drive in some runs.
Or you have Guillen as regular DH, and there goes the flexibility.
Call-ups to replace Guillen would be Larish more than likely. Clevlen should have come up instead of Raburn but there’s JL again. At least Brent is a good outfielder, and could even do some late inning defensive replacement work.
I doubt Leyland does any of these things. There are things going on that people on THIS BLOG have noticed weeks ago, so how is he mssing this stuff? Have I mentioned that I don’t think he’s a very good manager?

And to re-emphasize something I said the other day, Anderson has 69 plate appearances against lefties and has hit .262. What’s Raburn hitting?

Moves to make – Guillen to the DL, Raburn back to Toledo, Clevlen to Detroit.

Play J Anderson in left and when Guillen is healthy again use him as DH.

And finally – find a new manager.

Well surprise, surprise… another day, another Guillen injury! The guy is falling apart before our eyes and instead of putting him on the DL, JL & DD keep pulling out the duck-tape and patching him back together hoping he can limp along for another game.
So Anderson makes the big league roster out of spring training and plays very well, yet when Raburn gets called up after playing so-so at Toledo, he gets more playing time than Anderson (or so it seems to me without actually looking it up). As Rich said above, Anderson is hitting .262 in 69 AB’s against lefties. And what has Raburn done against lefties? He’s 0 for 11! This experiment (as some have so aptly named it) with Ryan should come to an immediate conclusion. But I know it won’t.

News like this is actually infuriating–bad enough Carlos has been hobblein (and that was abundantly evident when I saw him in Seattle), now you compound his difficulties with a sore shoulder. It’s pretty clear now why there was no “Clear and Present Danger” with him at the dish.
The clear and present danger lies in the stubborn belief of a a lovable ol’ coot who thinks he can recreate past glory simply by giving it the opportunity and hoping it comes true.
There are some fans in those stands. They pay to watch THEIR team. There are fans who (like it was said here on the BLOG), that watch every inning of every game. These fans deserve to have the best product on the field every day. Yes, there will be rest and recovery days for some players because of their age and/or position–but generally, you have to p[ut the best out there on a consistent basis in order to give you the best chance of winning.
It is very clear that Carlos is not at his best and he is not getting closer to it as he plays- the reverse is true, he is becoming more and more physically limited.
JL has gone far enough. It’s unfortunate about Thames and for different reasons, Raburn. But you have to move on.
Anderson brings energy, excitement and possbility to the lineup. Who knows how well he will hit LHP? Better than Raburn to be sure and maybe he gets a few Fielders choices, by beating out double plays. Maybe he steals 2nd and moves to 3rd on a passed ball or wild pitch. Maybe he beats a throw to the plate with a head first slide? Maybe he can actually score a run without even getting a hit against a LHP.
One thing we know–he will run those fly balls down wheterth in LF or RF and his uni will be dirty 3 innings into the game.
The guy deserves to be played regularly right now. And Yes—he should be hitting leadoff–it’s time for this team to step out of the past and the status quo mentalaity and do something different.

Didn’t take JL long………..once again we want him gone. He couldn’t manage last year, what made DD & MI to think he would do any better in ’09? I’d love to see someone else manage these guys and have no doubt they would win more games. I think most agree just a few managing changes in some games and the Tigers would have been able to pull off a win. And would someone please tell him not to walk out to the mound with his hand tucked into his pants…..not a good look.

Carlos is my Tiger, it pains me to see him in this situation. He needs to be DL’d for now. Having him as a healthy DH would be sweet. In my book he can still hit, he just needs to fine tune his at bats. He will be fine.

Go Tigers.

We all know that JL is loyal to a fault to his veteran players. Unless Carlos tells him he can’t go, he is going to continue playing. From the games I have seen, he still can swing the bat, just hitting it right at someone now. I agree that his place in the lineup should be DH, however. Just too much of a defensive liability. And although I agree with a lot of you about Anderson getting more starts in left, I’m not ready to put him in the leadoff position. By keeping him in the 7th slot it enables more flexibility with Everett . Adams’ value (besides solid defense) is his ability to do the little things like move runners over, bunt, etc. Keeping Josh in the bottom part of the order gives us a chance to score with that part of the lineup, unlike last year when we got beyond the 5th place hitter it was the dead zone.


When Guillen switched over to left handed last night, his swing was terrible and he was grimacing. Not surprising with a bad left shoulder. I don’t see how he can stay in the lineup. This is sad, because there’s not a person here who doesn’t like Carlos and thinks he can produce if healthy. But they have to get someone other than Raburn to replace him.
Anderson’s majority of ABs with both Houston and Atlanta was at leadoff. I’ll take the opinion of Bobby Cox over that of Jim Leyland. That’s a no-brainer.

Grandy loves being leadoff guy, so I’m not so sure how Anderson would do. Probably just fine. I wanted Carlos DL’d last week as it was obvious he was not in any condition to field. I cringe every time he’s out there and has to make a catch (which he usually doesn’t).

I like Leyland, I like him a lot. He should be a blogger like us and retire as manager. You must bunt Laird. You must take out Jackson. You must rest my wife’s Tiger, Carlos. How about putting my Tiger, Grandy, in the 3 hole. I never liked the platoon thing. Agree with everyone, Anderson in left and batting leadoff. Maybe Inge 5th and Maggs 6th. Inge has earned it. It is a long season and we need our players healthy for the dog days.
Go Tigers! –Dave

I think some people have forgotten just how bad Josh Anderson has been in LF too. I think we can pretty much attribute 2 game losses to him because of errors.

Left field is such a slaughter. I cringe every time a ball goes out that way. I’m starting to feel that way when the ball goes towards Maggs too.

Anderson is a rookie, so I’ll give him a pass for a couple blunders here and there. Baseball is a team game – I really don’t think you can attribute losses to any one person. If you really want to play that game, how many games has Carlos lost by playing hurt or not making plays? How many hits has he NOT gotten in key situations since his shoulder has been bothering him? I think this team is much better defensively with Anderson in LF. Granderson even mentioned in an interview last week that he’s able to shade more towards RF to help Magglio when Anderson is in LF because he knows Josh will run everything down.
I love that JL turned things around and got us back to the WS in ’06, but what has he done since? I’m starting to think that a change might be needed.

Well, seems like most of us agree that Anderson should be starting, at least until he plays his way out of that role. His speed is a weapon that we can’t afford to have just sitting on the bench. I wonder though, if moving Grandy to the third slot might have an effect on his production—might make him more apt to try and hit the HR ball and get him all out of whack. The Indians tried it with Sizemore and the experiment didn’t last long. The leadoff thing is overrated any way. You are only guaranteed to lead off once a game. After the first inning it’s anyone’s guess when you’ll come up again. I said it before, with Josh batting in the 8 slot, you can utilize Everett’s or Santiago’s ability to move him over and let Grandy or Polanco drive him in. I’m with all of you–he’s gotta play!


Well, Anderson will play tonight with Blackburn starting but it’s anybody’s guess what will happen tomorrow against the lefty Buerhle. I thought there may have been some kind of announcement by now, unless they plan on ignoring this injury too.
It’s not so much who hits leadoff as it is what order they hit in. I figure that Polanco is a good 2-strike hitter and can go deep into the count to give Anderson time to steal second. I don’t know if Granderson 3rd would work or not, but something has to be done to fill a hole in the lineup. It does give them L-R-L-R for the first four hitters, at least.
Certainly a case for Murphy’s Law. You release Sheffield then have both of your leftfielders injured.

Anderson isn’t going to get better at left sitting on the bench. The rookie needs to be playing every day and his skills will improve. You’re right about the Granderson interview. Anderson can cover a lot of ground in left.

Well I have been on the record that I like Leyland. With all do respect to everyone here, did they win in 2006 and for the better part of 2007 despite Jim Leyland. Not that there isn’t some fault here, I do think they sometimes he pulls his pitcher too late. Like last night for instance Jackson going into that 7th had something like 97 pitches in, so I said why is he putting him back in, he did a great job. But at the very least why didn’t he have someone warming up just in case????
So I don’t like everything he does but I am fairly certian he knows a lot more than I do. I think that Carlos at the very least should sit for a few days, I am certian of this we need him healthy and in the lineup.
Someone said something about Leyland having his hands down his pants. I noticed that as well and I think that he must have a hernia. I think that I noticed it a few weeks ago.
I wish they would start hitting the ball, there have been so many games that they just are getting so few hits, some of them they are still winning but 4 or 5 hits simply isn’t going to cut it.

Seriously don’t understand this. I just read that they did put Guillen on the DL. They recalled Jeff Larish and Clete Thomas. No offense to Clete, but he hasn’t really been lighting it up in Toledo. I believe that he is hitting below 200, and way below??? They are also sending Rapada down. Whatever. Continue to call up people who can’t hit. Clete did some really good things last year up here then he got hurt, and I wonder if he is ready?? Who’s decision is this?? Leylands, Dombrowski or combination???

Okay then, there it is.
Larish will give them DH flexibility and Thomas will give them a spare outfielder. Clete is good defensively and can also pinch run. I wouldn’t pay much attention to what he was doing in Toledo. Raburn is still there, but it would appear that some LH hitters will have to face LH pitchers. I hope that’s the plan with Anderson.
GK, I actually do think they won in 2006 despite Leyland. And, not trying to be contrary, I would send most any of our starters back out there with 97 pitches if they were going good. I don’t always disagree with the ol’ coot. 🙂

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