Leyland on pulling Jackson

Jim Leyland on the decision to pull Edwin Jackson in the 8th after 89 pitches: “There was no question that he was starting to go. There was no question about that. It was the perfect situation for Seay to come in, get out the one lefty who was a pretty good hitter. We got that. We felt real good about it, but there was no doubt in my mind about that. I don’t question that at all. He gave us everything you could ask for and more. Rolen hit the home run, and we had the unfortunate little play there that we didn’t make. That’s all part of the game.”

On another bullpen note, if the game had gone into extra innings, Leyland said that Ryan Perry would’ve pitched the 10th, which would’ve made for quite a Major League debut.

25 Comments

I was surprised that so many people want to jump on Inge. Especially after so many people demanded his return. The guy is going to make about 20 errors and about 50 fantastic plays this year. Get used to it–you asked for it. At least he’s hitting (for now).
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JL is not the goat. It’s the so called closer who blew it. Twice. Maybe he’ll get his act together. Maybe not. I still say, give Nate a shot at closing 2 or 3 games. Who knows? He couldn’t be much worse that Rodney or yesterday’s goat.
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And, hey, isn’t it nice not having Sheff in the lineup? Best wishes to him, but thank goodness he is gone!

I agree Todd. Brandon didn’t lose that game. I didn’t have a problem with JL pulling Edwin but I don’t get his use of the pen. First, why not leave Seay in there for more than one batter? That’s right he’s a lefty specialist. I forgot. Then, after Lyon blew the save, why did JL bring him back out in the 9th? You had Perry and Nate in the pen.

Hey, another day, another ????
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There were many positives including a quality starters effort and a manufactured run with a combined bunt and sac fly – Rich might be able to go back in history when we last achieved this!!
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We have to go easy on JL – he is not used to having speed so hopefully his faux pas leaving Maggs in the game will be his first and last missed opportunity.
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We cant go easy on JL continuing to play his bullpen as if they are chess pieces and not a bunch of fragile human beings with confidence generally at non existent levels the past few seasons. This was one of the most galling things of his management last year. JL, IF A RELIEF PITCHER IS THROWING STRIKES, KEEP HIM IN!!! IF HE WALKS ONE IN UNDER 6 PITCHES, PULL HIM!!!
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The most exasperating thing is we have all been saying since November that we needed to spend around $9-10m for a quality experienced closer, to be the glue for a flighty and young bullpen. We replaced the $7m on Todd Jones retirement with $4.25m on Lyon (51 career saves from 71 attempts; 71.8%), an additional $1m to $2.7m on Rodney (33 of 58; 56.9%) and Zoom $735,000 (1 of 16; 6.3%). On a team payroll of $132m, the $1.75m saved on last year, and approx. $1.5m saved if all 3 were swapped for a quality closer with stats in the high 80′s is going to haunt all of us, Mr Illich especially for the rest of the year.
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Ryan Perry is going to have to be special and given a chance real soon.

Sorry, I meant to save $1.5m additional to swap the 3 for one quality closer..

Sorry, I meant to say $1.5m additional to swap the 3 for one quality closer..

I agree I think that on the first outing of the year that is about how long they keep a starter in. They are not ready for many more pitches than that. And while Brandon Inge is no blame free, Cabrera has to learn to pick some of that stuff. Sean Casey would of had that. I also wondered why Lyon was put back in for the 9th it isn’t like he was good in the 8th.
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This is very discouraging already, it feels a lot like last year, which isn’t giving me that warm and fuzzy feeling. For a pitching staff that did pretty well in spring so far they have given up 17 runs in 2 games???? That isn’t good folks, not good at all. And the thing about it is that Toronto isn’t known for their hitting prowess (spelling boy I wish their was spell check on this).
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Well I will keep hoping for better. I am the eternal optimist. (right)

I don’t fault JL for pulling Jackson – first game of the season, into the 8th inning with a terrific game and pros that are supposed to be backing him up. Such a shame for Jackson, although I am glad he won’t get tagged with the loss. Props to Inge for his power hitting the first 2 games of the season, might we see the Brandon of old?

I will hold off on my rant on Lyon, but it is killing me. I’ll give him more than one game, I just can’t let spring training control my thoughts on someone new, but my patience won’t last forever! Stinks to start off in an 0-2 hole that will make the guys want to press too much to get back to even before the home opener. And yes, my husband is reveling in my sorrow.

I don’t fault JL for pulling Jackson – first game of the season, into the 8th inning with a terrific game and pros that are supposed to be backing him up. Such a shame for Jackson, although I am glad he won’t get tagged with the loss. Props to Inge for his power hitting the first 2 games of the season, might we see the Brandon of old?

I will hold off on my rant on Lyon, but it is killing me. I’ll give him more than one game, I just can’t let spring training control my thoughts on someone new, but my patience won’t last forever! Stinks to start off in an 0-2 hole that will make the guys want to press too much to get back to even before the home opener. And yes, my husband is reveling in my sorrow.

sorry for the double post – I got an error message so I re-sent.

Leyland pulling Jackson isn’t even an issue, I don’t think. That was the correct move. I’d like to see more creative use of the bullpen. I entered a post about it but it didn’t go through. I wish they’d fix this blog system.
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In the end, you’ve got to win these close games, and until they prove capable of it, nobody will be comfortable with this season’s outlook.
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–Rich

Some positives about last night. Jackson was awesome and I’m very impressed and hope he can bring more of that everytime he pitches. I remember him being wild in the past but he was hammering the strike zone last night. JV could take notes from him about going after hitters and not wasting pitches.
Also Marcus’ RBI double was big and hopefully Leyland will keep him in the lineup for good. He deserves a shot to show he can play everyday.
Good article on last night’s game on SI.com. Inge had comments about the team’s positive attitude and I liked what Jackson had to say about Lyon and picking up your teammates.

My point about Inge (actually verified by Inge in an interview later), is that he panciked. I like Inge at 3rd as much as anybody but I have observed that he tends to make his mistakes when he has time to think instead of simply react. Do I blame the game on him—no. Did that play change the game-yes.
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Is it fair to be down on JL? Again, yes it is. He forgets his own strategy. Last year we saw him announce strategy then immediately supercede his own decisions. This year we have Ordonez on base with a lead in the 8th and the versatility, speed and defense needed (and traded for), remaining on the bench. What other type of situation was Anderson acquired for? Bringing Lyon out again in the 9th was also worth criticizing. As to taking Jackson out. I would actually have taken him out earlier and started the 8th off with Lyon. Again, I thought “The Plan” was to have Lyon setup and Rodney close (at least the 1st game anyway!).
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I feel Verlander will become the pitcher we think he should be. He does need to accept the fact that he has room to learn and adapt. He still has a mentality that he can physically overmatch a batter at will. he can’t. He has to outwit them too. One way of helping this IMO, is to vary his pace on the mound. When he gets going on his rapid style delivery system he helps the batters with their timing mechanism. He can change-up, off-speed 2 seam, 4 seam whatever he likes. But the batter simply has to adjust to the flight of the ball. The batters have seemed to be primed and triggered when he delivers. I’d like to see him vary his pace and make these guys think about it a bit.
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We need a complete game from the entire squad today. We can’t rely on a shut-down performance from Miner or the Venezuelan Vaqueros to pound the Jays into submission. We need to see manufactured runs, timely hitting, clutch pitching and solid confident defense. An all around effort is what is needed to instill the confidence that this is indeed a “team”.

My point about Inge (actually verified by Inge in an interview later), is that he panciked. I like Inge at 3rd as much as anybody but I have observed that he tends to make his mistakes when he has time to think instead of simply react. Do I blame the game on him—no. Did that play change the game-yes.
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Is it fair to be down on JL? Again, yes it is. He forgets his own strategy. Last year we saw him announce strategy then immediately supercede his own decisions. This year we have Ordonez on base with a lead in the 8th and the versatility, speed and defense needed (and traded for), remaining on the bench. What other type of situation was Anderson acquired for? Bringing Lyon out again in the 9th was also worth criticizing. As to taking Jackson out. I would actually have taken him out earlier and started the 8th off with Lyon. Again, I thought “The Plan” was to have Lyon setup and Rodney close (at least the 1st game anyway!).
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I feel Verlander will become the pitcher we think he should be. He does need to accept the fact that he has room to learn and adapt. He still has a mentality that he can physically overmatch a batter at will. he can’t. He has to outwit them too. One way of helping this IMO, is to vary his pace on the mound. When he gets going on his rapid style delivery system he helps the batters with their timing mechanism. He can change-up, off-speed 2 seam, 4 seam whatever he likes. But the batter simply has to adjust to the flight of the ball. The batters have seemed to be primed and triggered when he delivers. I’d like to see him vary his pace and make these guys think about it a bit.
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We need a complete game from the entire squad today. We can’t rely on a shut-down performance from Miner or the Venezuelan Vaqueros to pound the Jays into submission. We need to see manufactured runs, timely hitting, clutch pitching and solid confident defense. An all around effort is what is needed to instill the confidence that this is indeed a “team”.

I don’t understand the anger towards Inge. He had an error, big deal. Watching the replay it looked like Cabrera should have picked that throw. A more experienced 1B probably would have, but he is getting better. But that error isn’t what lost the game – it was Lyon’s horrid pitching and Leyland leaving him in and then bringing him back out for the 9th. I really think he’s a waste of a roster spot, not to mention the $4M+ they’re paying him this year.
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I, too, would like to see Leyland use the bullpen differently. I’ve long been a believer that you let the situation dictate who you bring in, not the need to get certain guys more work. That’s a spring training philosophy, IMO. Throw the schedule out the window and bring in the best guy for the situation at hand.
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My last point may not be very popular, but it’s something I was thinking about all winter: Why not trade Magglio? His age isn’t working in his favor, and neither is his speed (or lack of). We need an outfield that can chase down balls hit to the corners and some speed on the basepaths right now. The offense would be fine without him, and besides, you never know what the young guys can do unless you give them a shot at playing regularly. This would also free up enough cash so Dumb-browski can finally get a real closer.

The problem with trading Ordonez, Buck, is his contract. It’s huge. DD gave him a nice award back when they were trying to lure talent, and to make Detroit an attractive destination. That’s fine, but now it’s got our hands tied financially. I doubt anyone would want to take on Maggs’ contract. Maybe at the trade deadline, if at all. At least he’s still very popular, at least in Detroit.
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Strange schedule this year. With the west coast games starting so late, tonight is our last primetime TV appearance till April 24! This is a good thing for those of you who may suffer from PTSD (prime time spousal dispute).
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–Rich

Believe me, I understand the constraints of Magglio’s contract – the Tigers are paying him too much. When you add to that the burden of Sheff’s $14M that they’re still paying this year and the $4M being wasted on Lyon, we could have gone out and acquired Putz or K-Rod. Very poor decisions being made by the front office lately.

no problem pulling jackson.but why bring in lyon.we have seen his results.i think it time to fire leland

It’s going to be another year where Leyland has only bad choices in the bullpen, because DD failed to address the problem adequately in the off season. NOT ONE single Tiger reliever had even a decent season in the major leagues the previous year. Not one. Lyon is the best of a bad lot, with a 1.48 WHIP and a 4.70 ERA in the NL West. The same GM that brought you Francisco Cruceta, Jose Mesa, Eduardo Campusano, Matt Mantei, and Joey Eischen, has now brought you Kyle Bloom, Juan Rincon, Brandon Lyon, and Scott Williamson to fix the bullpen. When you’re up against Jenks, Nathan, Soria, and Wood, how do you THINK it’s gonna come out?

It’s going to be another year where Leyland has only bad choices in the bullpen, because DD failed to address the problem adequately in the off season. NOT ONE single Tiger reliever had even a decent season in the major leagues the previous year. Not one. Lyon is the best of a bad lot, with a 1.48 WHIP and a 4.70 ERA in the NL West. The same GM that brought you Francisco Cruceta, Jose Mesa, Eduardo Campusano, Matt Mantei, and Joey Eischen, has now brought you Kyle Bloom, Juan Rincon, Brandon Lyon, and Scott Williamson to fix the bullpen. When you’re up against Jenks, Nathan, Soria, and Wood, how do you THINK it’s gonna come out?

It’s going to be another year where Leyland has only bad choices in the bullpen, because DD failed to address the problem adequately in the off season. NOT ONE single Tiger reliever had even a decent season in the major leagues the previous year. Not one. Lyon is the best of a bad lot, with a 1.48 WHIP and a 4.70 ERA in the NL West. The same GM that brought you Francisco Cruceta, Jose Mesa, Eduardo Campusano, Matt Mantei, and Joey Eischen, has now brought you Kyle Bloom, Juan Rincon, Brandon Lyon, and Scott Williamson to fix the bullpen. When you’re up against Jenks, Nathan, Soria, and Wood, how do you THINK it’s gonna come out?

It’s going to be another year where Leyland has only bad choices in the bullpen, because DD failed to address the problem adequately in the off season. NOT ONE single Tiger reliever had even a decent season in the major leagues the previous year. Not one. Lyon is the best of a bad lot, with a 1.48 WHIP and a 4.70 ERA in the NL West. The same GM that brought you Francisco Cruceta, Jose Mesa, Eduardo Campusano, Matt Mantei, and Joey Eischen, has now brought you Kyle Bloom, Juan Rincon, Brandon Lyon, and Scott Williamson to fix the bullpen. When you’re up against Jenks, Nathan, Soria, and Wood, how do you THINK it’s gonna come out?

It’s going to be another year where Leyland has only bad choices in the bullpen, because DD failed to address the problem adequately in the off season. NOT ONE single Tiger reliever had even a decent season in the major leagues the previous year. Not one. Lyon is the best of a bad lot, with a 1.48 WHIP and a 4.70 ERA in the NL West. The same GM that brought you Francisco Cruceta, Jose Mesa, Eduardo Campusano, Matt Mantei, and Joey Eischen, has now brought you Kyle Bloom, Juan Rincon, Brandon Lyon, and Scott Williamson to fix the bullpen. When you’re up against Jenks, Nathan, Soria, and Wood, how do you THINK it’s gonna come out?

Sorry for the repetition. The page froze up and wound up sending multiples. My point does bear repeating, though! lol.

It’s true that the club didn’t bring in better relievers, but Leyland will have to manage the group he has. He needs to stop following some “book” that was written by other managers with much better bullpen talent and get creative. Use Seay for more than LH hitters, bring in the closer (even if it is Rodney) when Lyon is obviously struggling, etc. There’s no point in looking for the perfect spot to give Perry his first appearance. He was the best reliever in camp and he’s not a child. We could forfeit half a season trying to get everyone’s roles in order.
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I’d also flip-flop Ordonez and Guillen in the order. Maggs is too slow to hit in front of Cabrera, and Guillen is faster and smarter on the bases, and always gives you a good AB.
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–Rich

I used to get angry watching how the various trades/signing pan out with this team. This acquisition of Lyons is downright funny. I mean, exactly WHO DO THEY THINK THEY SIGNED?? I mean, Willie Hernandez or John Hiller, he aint!!! NEVER gonna be. Lyons is an average, AT BEST errrrr….. shall we say… closer???!!!! Comes a time, when some of these teams need to STOP playing certain players, regardless of the $$ being spent on them.

Lyons stinks. The Backs know this!! Verlander is by far overrated; not because of his inability, but because he’s not a coachable pitcher. The “art of pitching” has just never sunk in with this guy.

If the Tigers would send these 2 bums down where they belong, it would immediatly add 10 wins to this teams season. Don’t be fooled if either comes out now and then and pitches effectively because that is NOT what you’re going to get week after week.

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