For reference sake

Six teams since 1900 have started a season 0-4 or worse and gone on to make the postseason. All of them were in the divisional play era:

  1. 1999 Diamondbacks — NL West champs
  2. 1995 Reds — NL Central champs
  3. 1985 Cardinals — NL Champs
  4. 1981 Astros — NL Wild Card
  5. 1977 Phillies — NL East champs
  6. 1974 Pirates — NL East champs
  7. 1969 Twins — AL West champs

Stretch that out to 0-5, and only the ’95 Reds and ’74 Pirates pulled that off.

58 Comments

Not much consolation but, KC is playing pretty good ball against Minnesota too. Cuddyer just slid into 3rd head first and hurt his hand…

Guess i spoke to soon, Minnesota wins the game.

unrelated to fishermans posts or to the blog in general.
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but…
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clete thomas needs to be a fixture. this guy is dealing. he’s wheeling, and he’s having fun. did you guys see that sac bunt? he almost had his head ripped off and he’s in the dugout laughing abouit it with pudge… no one else was smiling. the tigers need him i think.
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this kid couldn’t be happier to be doing what he’s doing, and he’s making a name for himself. he’s a baseball player, and he’s playing for ‘nothing’ cuz i think when grandy’s back, he’s gone. in the meantime, nike needs to sign him to a contract to sell cletes.

No doubt Clete Thomas (great baseball name by the way) has been one of the lone bright spots on this team. I would take a team full of Cletes and Curtises along with a strong pitching staff and take my chances. It’s fun, all out youthful baseball…the way it should be.
It’s kind of funny, everyone seems so concerned about the awful start. Actually losing the first 4 could be a good thing if it humbles folks a bit. It ain’t gonna be easy gettin to the playoffs. I think a lot of people thought it would be. It’s still about pitching. This staff is decent but how much better than that remains to be seen. So they still have to score runs to win 90-95 games. And I think they’ll start doing that, but…. they can’t wait too much longer.
Last thought. One thing I miss is that kind of innocent feeling we had in 2006. Nobody expected anything from our Tigers and baseball fans I think felt it was a great (feel good) story. With the 2nd largest payroll in baseball, don’t expect any sympathy for failure nor support for winning any more. Human nature…we all like a good Cinderella story.
Other than that, I haven’t much to say lately, but, to quote Thumper’s mother, “If you can’t say anythiiiiing good, don’t say anythiiiiiing at allllll.”
Oh yeah, Dan, we don’t want Bonds if that’s what you were implying. Get a hold of yourself man:)

Hey Marty–just “stirrin’ the pot” Bro’.
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But you know there is some logic in it (I don’t think Bonds would be good for this team), if Sheff were to go down for an extended time. Ideally if our DH were a power LHB it would really help to balance out theis lineup. Bonds would be available cheap and is actually ideally suited as a DH at this stage of his “evolution”.
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Once again, I do not think he should be or want him to be, on this team. But a long-term injury to Sheffield would certainly instigate those types of rumors and speculation.
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I hope Sheff can play with this latest physical diversion. I have my doubts. He seems a little obsessed with his various body parts being in perfect condition. I would hate to see him with another repeat of trying to overcome a physical impairment like he tried last year.
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It could be tough slogging right througe this weekend. What we really need is an overpowering performance from one of our starters (may it please be Willis?!), to kick start the offense. The offense didn’t look that great in the last game either IMO. Lack of timely hitting, inability to string a few hits together and to take advantage of opportunities are really hurting the overall team dynamic.
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I think Grilli has really painted himself into a corner. It’s not just that he has had poor performances it is because he has had “loud” poor performances. When he breaks down it can become a total meltdown. There is almost a sense of futility and he does not appear to be able to overcome a couple of bad pitches. I don’t think they will be able to allow him to have many more bad outings as he is the “front and center” whipping boy on this staff. I think even the fact that he is on JL’s long “I like him; I like him a lot” list, will not save him if he can’t find a synchronicity with his “good stuff”.
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It is nice to see good things happen for Clete Thomas. Right now their is a disconnect with his performance and with the club. I think we will truly be able to measure his impact when his energy impacts those around him. Does he have the kind of character that can pick up the team? I don’t think we should expect that but every team needs a few motivational type players in their dugout. Curtis can do that and maybe, just maybe, so can Cabrera. He is under a lot of pressure here right now and also is taking a bit of a back seat to his older countrymen Guillen and Ordonez. He will eventually be taking a back seat to nobody and we all really enjoy that transformation when it happens.
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I think you are right Marty about the humbling factor. I would be on the moon if we were 4 and 0H right now, but this struggle may be a pretty valuable education for the guys (and one that I think JL was afraid of).

Very astute observations, Marty. I received a book called “Tales from the Detroit Tigers Dugout” by Jack Ebling and I glanced through it this morning. He’s talking about the 2006 season and I found myself missing those times. Times of innocence at my age is a rare thing indeed. :-)
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I hate to pour water on the Clete Thomas flames, but we’ll have to see what happens when other teams get a book on him. If we’ve seen it once, we’ve seen it a thousand times, where a youngster comes up and goes on a tear for a week or so. Anyone remember George Smith of the 1963 Tigers? Don’t get me wrong, I like Clete. He’s paying attention, happily receiving instruction, and doing everything correctly. I think he’s someone we can use further down the line. I’ve already seen posts, however, of dropping Jones and others in place of Thomas. That’s very very premature. Let’s not forget we heard the same rumblings when Brent Clevlen hit one out of Fenway and halfway to Cambridge.
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I’ve also been thinking along the lines of a “wakeup call” for this team. They’ve fallen into the trap of thinking just showing up will win them games. They verbally denounce it, but that’s a subconscious thing and it happens in all sports. Just human nature. When they start digging in and grinding, as JL puts it, they’ll be fine. You just don’t want to dig too deep of a hole for yourself.
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One of Sheff’s biggest positives and negatives is he really is a team guy. He’ll try to get in there and contribute even when he shouldn’t. I really don’t understand some of the negative comments that get posted on other sites. Not referring to you, Dan, I know where you stand.
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Grilli, I still think needs to be cut. What worries me is that he doesn’t seem to recognize failure when it happens to him. Always the positive comments, but no results to show for it. Everyone knows I’m in the “I like him, I like him a lot” club, but reality is what it is. He probably needs a fresh start somewhere, because he’s dead in Detroit. Having said that, I realize that the chances of him getting cut are on an even par with Matt Millen being fired or GW Bush admitting Iraq was a mistake.
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Well, that’s my pregame. I’m curious to see if today’s game will appear on MLB.TV, since the site notes that Fox blackouts don’t begin until May 17.
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–RIch

Omigosh, I’ve completely broken the rules for posting comments about the Tigers by not mentioning Brandon Inge. I’ll do that right now.
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Brandon Inge.
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Okay, NOW let’s play ball. :-)
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–Rich

Nice post as usual Dan. Had to reply on your Clete comment. Right now Clete’s disconnect is that he is playing well, while the majority of the team isn’t:) Being an AA rookie making no money (well that’s relative of course) among so many highly paid veterans, I don’t think he is in any position, yet at least, to motivate in any other way but playing the game hard and enthusiastically. For instance it might have been awkward had he approached Shef after he was thrown out diving head first into 2nd and said something like….”Nice idea Shef, it took a perfect throw to get you. But just my humble opinion, maybe next time, I don’t know, how about sliding feet first, cause you’re a great player and we need you healthy for the entire season.”

You make a good point Dan. It’s a little early for the first report card on Clete. Let’s see if he can keep up his intensity and avoid slumps and mistakes. That of course depends on whether he continues to get significant playing time.

Hey Rich, Another good post. I made my little Shef comment before reading yours. Honest. I’m a Shef fan so I was only funning. But I do wish he would just reign it in a smidge so we can enjoy his skills for an entire season.

Raburn has been ent down and Beltran called up from Toledo. I wonder if something is afoot with DD? That’s a lot of pitchers to be carrying.
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shouldve sent girli down instead of raburn.

and by send down, i mean sent him to T-ball league, and those kids would still bang out homers :)

I guess on one hand it is a little odd to say this (considering the way the Sox aren’t hitting)–but he is on borrowed time with al lthese pitches and without any control. This (the 6th) will be his last inning even if they don’t get a hit.

Way to go Brandon

STOP the train wreck before it happens

Just for the record – These Fox announcers drive me nuts. (I’ve never liked listening to the Fox games) Not that I thought in a million years that Willis would throw a no-hitter, but if someone is throwing a no-hitter in the 6th, it is baseball etiquette not to mention anything until that first hit occurs. The announcers state that the Sox had no hits, the next pitch ends up on the warning tracks. I guess I’m just superstitious :)
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Jason – any news on how Zumaya is progressing?

i hope the tigers are getting their july/aug/september slump out of the way here in april and will just dominate the rest of the season.
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tie game now… wheeeeeeeeee…… i need a drink.
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-mike

Well I am slipping back into resignation mode once more. When it rains it pours. Thome getting the 1st hit against a guy who should be able to get him out. Thomas making his 1st mistake in CF, Miner not being able to live up to the term of “relief” pitcher, etc etc.
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Again we have no offense to speak of (if you subtract Inge). We really need to switch gears pretty soon or Illitch will also have to sign a team shrink too.
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I actually feel sorry for JL.

ok.. idk about anyone else here, but these strikeouts have to stop!!!! they play dice-k monday or tuesday, and he already has 15 stikeouts (according to MLB, but 6 of those were from a march 25 game…. dont know why thats counting for regular season stats, maybe an anomoly) and the tigers are driving me CRAZY with these strikeouts! .
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JL needs to get some MOTIVATION in the roster.
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not watching the game, fox here is showing dodgers/padres. BORING. the SD catcher made an absolutely amazing play, caught the ball, fell into the dugout, then got up and ran back the running that was tagging from third. (dont know why, but the catch was ruled an error, and the umps let 3b runner score. i was just saying ‘HUH??’
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anyways. i dont like very much, his pre-pitch batting motions irritate me and almost make me seasick. he looks out of his element and almost afraid. thames should’ve been LF today. i dont know why thames doesn’t get more ABs. especially in this RUT they’re in.
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BLAH!
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STOP STRIKING OUT.

beltron’s pitching now…..

oops btw, i was refering to jacques jones in the last paragraph of my last post.

mike

I think those strikeouts were from the series in Japan. Those were real games.

It’s looking pretty bleak right now.
Polanco is now into a mode where is making easy outs. Lots of swings early in the count.
Ordonez is now measuring success by NOT swinging at the 1st pitch or NOT hitting into a DP.
Cabrera is a non-factor.
You can expect some inconsistency from Jones, Rodriguez, Renteria but those 3 not hitting (and last I looked Sheffield wasn’t hitting either) we’ve got some major concerns.
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This game is almost certainly over. These guys just don’t have it in ‘em right now. Jenks coming in now and we can all hope for a minor miracle here against him to help this club outta this funk they are in. Depressing.

Thought for sure either Inge or Clete was going to become a legend today in the 9th….. Just wasnt meant to be.
Good luck tomorrow guys.

How long was Granderson expected to be out?
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These guys need some sort of fire. The tv shot goes to the dugout and these guys are all sitting on the bench, long faces, no cheering, no enthusiasm. It almost looks like the dog days of August where everyone is tired.

I don’t know what their problem is but it really isn’t good. I knew watching the game that Willis wasn’t going to get away with all of the walks forever but???

You don’t win many games with three runs. The bullpen can be blamed, but it wouldn’t be accurate.
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Now……..here’s Rodney with another injury. Doesn’t it seem like everytime Zumaya is out, Rodney is either injured, ineffective, or both? Make of that what you will. I’m just sayin’……………..
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Well, what I’m sayin’ is forget Fernando Rodney. The Tiger organization makes a continuing mistake by relying on him. They’ll probably need to trade some of these hitters for some arms. I suggest putting Renteria out there because we never needed him in the first place. We just may end up with the same offensive output but improved pitching.
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As it stands now, we can’t beat Chicago. We can’t beat Cleveland. We’re lucky to split with Boston and New York, so someone tell me how this calculates into any more than 80-85 wins. What I foresee is a struggle throughout April and May, then the usual impressive roll through interleague play. Then the All Star break, then back to struggling.
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I’d sure like to be proven wrong with these observations.
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–Rich

Even watching the FOX broadcast after the game they actually came out and said that it is not the hitting, but it is the pitching?? I am beginning to wonder if anyone of the national guys know what the heck they are talking about. Yes Willis gave up too many walks and it was going to come back and bite him in the butt. However we only got eight hits (again none of them timely except for a few) They even went as far as to say that Dontrelle must be hurt he wasn’t throwing his fastball any higher than the mid 80’s. Which if you look at the speeds on the gameday he had plenty in the low to mid-90’s.

I will tell you what I think that the problem is the hitting of Polanco, Ordonez and Cabrera. Actually what it seems to me is that there is a different guy that hits on different days, but not 5 or 6 on one day. Today it was Jones, Inge and Thomas. Yesterday was Pudge, and Thomas. Anyway you get my point. Did you also notice that our pitching seems to be doing alright the first 5 innings but the 6th is the tough one. Justin on Monday they didn’t score a run until the 6th then the 7th it blew up. Kenny put the kybosh on them until the 6th but the 6th he gave up 2 and we didn’t score any runs. Bonderman was okay through 3 and gave up 2 in the 4th 1 in the 6th but we only scored one run that game. Now Robertsons start was a little different, more back and forth scoring – again just not enough by us.
Then today they didn’t score until the sixth and got 4 runs one more in the 8th. But we only scored 3 freaking runs. You cannot expect your pitching staff to be perfect you have to get them some runs. Nor can you expect your hitters to be perfect. But to me right now it is all about the hitting. But we have only scored 13 runs in 5 games. CAN WE SAY HITTING??????????

So when the fox guys say it is not the hitting, but the pitching, I just wonder what the heck they are watching??

I tell you I am in complete and total shock. It is beyond me.

I am going to the game Sunday night. I am hoping for something better. Verlander needs to get it together.

Hello my fellow BloggaTigers. First time this year for me. I’ve sat back and watched and read, and now I shall comment. About 6 weeks ago, I told you all we would need Inge more than inge needs us. Isn’t it a shame that the “spoiled brat”, et al”, leads the team in HR and RBI’s.
When the season is over, he will be no where near the top in either. My comment is really said to close the door on anyone who felt like he wasn’t a true team mate. As an everyday third base starter, he’s overpaid; but as a valuable athlete needed to stabilize a new ship with new parts, he is grossly underpaid. We had a very good team last year, and we needed relief pitching to seal the deal.
What we did was give away every young star we had for more hitting(I still know Cabrera can hit), and a smiling left hander who can’t throw strikes. What we are left with is a team with no relief pitching, and right now no hitting. I’m sure Brandon Inge would be willing to give an inning or two from the pen, and I’d bet he would have done better than Grilli did yesterday. Yes, this 49 year Tiger fanatic fan is a little peaved at his guys right now. Sometimes greed can get in the way of true success.

Inge is doing what he needs to do for himself to get off this team. Everything is revolving around him, but we are not winning games. He thrives on being the center of attention even if it’s negative. He should have been long gone weeks ago. I would have paid to dump him and let this team gel.

Little harsh there now aren’t ya??? I really don’t think that it is true and even if it is who cares. I will take any help where I can get it.

I guess we’re all going to blame our favorite target, be it Inge, Rodney, Grilli, etc. The fact is, it takes a team to win and it takes a team to lose.
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Now, a few weeks from now, after the Tigers have starting winning some games, we may look back on this week and laugh at ourselves for being premature in our judgements. When the end of September rolls around, however, and we’ve missed the playoffs by 3 to 5 games, we won’t look so dumb.
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GK, I think those network “experts” just work from the same script, and that script says the Tigers will have bullpen problems so that’s the theme they will pound, perhaps all season long, justified or not. Fortunate for me today that MLB.TV did indeed carry the game. Also fortunate was the fact that MLB.TV doesn’t carry that postgame garbage from Fox.
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–Rich

Maybe it does sound harsh, but it’s the truth as I see it. Other don’t agree but that’s OK. Most of our regular bench players aren’t even getting playing time because Inge gets it all. I know they are trying to highlight him for other teams but I think it has created a rift on the team. I may be completely off base and hope I’m wrong, but I don’t think so right now.

Has anyone taken a look as some of the standings?? It is bizarro world
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American league east
#1Baltimore…#2Tampa…Toronto#3…Boston#4….Yankees#5..
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The American League Central
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#1 White Soxs…#2Kansas City…#3 Twins…#4 Cleveland…and Detroit #5

National League East
Florida #1…. Washington #2… Mets #3….Atlanta #4…. Phildelphia #5

The other divisions are not so that weird. But all the teams that were anticipated to be contending are all losing to inferior teams. Its weird. Not sure that it makes me feel any better but thought I would point it out. Tigers have a lot of catchup to do.

I cannot figure out how to make paragraphs in this new format. Sorry this all looks rather weird.

There appears to be ongoing technical problems with the BLOG. This has nothing to do with Jason. It’s a bit wierd though when you consider that the one thing a BLOG is supposed to do is NOT being done well here (simply post a comment). Not sure why the tech people can’t get this dialed in.
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The pages load interminably at times. There are times where you lose your post in the middle of it which is something that will be so annoying it will chase people away. And (this has been complained about often) the formatting problem has not been resolved.
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This could be a directive from “The Chamber”. With the Tigers struggling the hierarchy may be controlling the masses by stifling their opinions.
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I would like to have everyone rest easy as I can make another fearless prediction that will put your minds at ease: The Tigers are absolutely not going to lose a ballgame tomorrow.
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As to today, well they have their work cut out for them. They are battling themselves as much as their opponents right now. And I know JL has the covered the distinction betwen “pressing” and “anxiety” quite well in his mind, but in my mind, these guys are “pressing”. And realistically what else could one expect. They will press untill the snap out of it, and it won’t all happen at once but individually. IMO, the most important guy they need right now to get untracked is Polanco. He was hitting ropes to start the season (after a torrid spring) and went unrewarded. I think he became frustrated and figured he was doing something wrong at the plate. Well, he is now. He is swinging early in the count and is even showing signs of trying to pull the ball. I think he is one of the keys and if he can come out tonight and get himself 2 or 3 hits it will pick the club up.
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We need our starters to really bear down. They seem to let up when they get ahead of the hitter. Nate lost a couple of LHB when he should have been able to “throw ‘em a chair” as did Willis. The starters need to be able to pitch to contact but they also need to be able to get a K when they can use it. Bonderman and Willis have one K collectively, in 11 innings. These guys are considered to be strikeout pitchers.
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They really need a pick-me-up. I saw Maggs in the dugout yesterday looking perplexed and scanning the bench from right to left. I think he was looking around for someone that figured might be able to lead this team out of their doldrums. He is a large part of the problem right now. It is painfully obvious he is not confident at the dish and is swinging at 1st and 2nd pitches far too much. Maybe that is what JL calls “anxious”.
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Inge has shown his value so far, even amidst the team’s poor results. I don’t think the situation is ideal but I also don’t think he has created a rift in the clubhouse. He is well liked by his mates and his manger regardless of how things have been painted by the media. I don’t think JL is showcasing him either. Not now, not in the regular season. He is not likely to be traded IMO, mostly because of his contract, unless a team loses their everday 3rd baseman. And the only thing we could really use in return for him is a proven relief pitcher. That is a commodity that I don’t see anybody is in a position to part with. Inge will not be the guy to carry this club at any point, but I think he will be a very valuable asset for us if he stays.
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This takes me back to the starters–we really need Bonderman to assert himself and Willis to be able to throw strikes. If those two stars cross then I think we will have a successful season. Verlander should be OK, Rogers will if he stays healthy and Robertson will be Robertson–he’ll win almost as many as he loses.
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We really need the mashers to start mashing too. Those Sheffield, Ordonez, Cabrera have to be able to scare the pants of of RHP or the lineup will not click. Right now they are being handled relatively easily.
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The bullpen. Frightful word. It’s a word that draws battle lines between media and management, and between fans and Bloggers alike. Quite simply it is a problem. Period.
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It would be reckless, unobservant and naive to blame the pen for everything. But, it is a big part of every team’s results. People get kind’ caught up in finding one “reason” for everything going wrong. And then you have the opposing viewpoint that it is not that reason but actually another one. Sounds kind of like the ingredients that lead to international conflict doesn’t it? Nothing is that simple. The bullpen is under pressure (both by the nature of the job and of the expectations of fans) but they are an extension of the team. The whole team is the problem right now. I’m not saying the bullpen is faultless or that it is a good one. I don’t think it is. I think we need some shoring up in that area. And you can bet there will more changes there in the coming days or weeks. But, the funk the club is in is pretty universal. It’s going to take a concerted effort to turn things around. Camraderie needs to be maintained and an avoidance of the “blame game” is crucial.
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Well said Dan, there is enough blame to go around to everyone. With the exception of a few players nobody is really doing all that they should be able to do.
But they cannot wait to much longer to get it in gear because it isn’t going to get any easier facing the Red Soxs this week.

GO TIGERS

Re-read David Tiger’s blog. He nailed it. I am in complete agreement David. Careful though, you’re flirting with baseball treason. Is there such a thing? Anyway, well said David.

We’re not putting down what the team has so much as lamenting the direction that might have been taken. That is, look within for help to shore up pitching (it was there), not trade it away for more hitting. Now….It is what it is. When we start beating up teams 10-7 you can all rub it in my face.

Right now I have little confidence in Willis or Bonderman. A little more in Nate. The only two starters I feel confident to win or set us up for one are Justin and Kenny. Stop considering Rodney for any future contribution. Then if he does, it will be a pleasant bonus. I’m just about there with my feelings on Zumaya, but hold out hope.

Dan, I think I’m finally getting what you have been saying all along about the bullpen. It is imperative to have a strong one to have success in this age of modern baseball. In fact it is the key. Think about it; with a strong pen that can slam the door shut, the rest of the team just feeds off that. Starters can pitch more relaxed and hitters don’t need to feel the pressure especially late in a game. This pressure to produce runs has to affect even the best of hitters, and we have a few of them (at least on paper). Am I getting at the core of what you’re saying Dan?

I don’t see the fire in this team that I’d like to see. Not sure if it’s just my perception or take, but I’d just like to see more determination in the eyes, in the body language. And I’m not talking about slamming bats or throwing gloves when things don’t go well. It’s an intensity for 9 innings, no matter winning or getting crushed. (It’s not whether you win or lose, it’s how you play the game as the saying goes. Although I don’t think the spirit behind that old saying counts for much anymore.)

I have no answers Dan. It is what it is. Rich, I like your observations up there too (not sure we’ve seen that side of you:) Renteria for a relief pitcher. Hmm, that’s a pretty good call. We had a guy already who could have done a decent job, given the chance but………… the grass is always greener as they say. And we could still have Jurrjens……ooo sorry bout that.

I just finished a great book entitled “How to Win Friends and Influence People”. Just stirrin’ the pot Dan:)

Okay, positive comments to start. The Tigers will probably win tonight, for no other reason than nobody goes 0-162. They will have to grind and grind hard until the lineup is normalized, mainly meaning Granderson back in there. And even after all this, we’re only three games behind first place Chicago.
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Dan, I did like your term “shoring up” the bullpen. A total makeover isn’t needed, but some help definitely will be needed, and pretty soon. Because of Rodney, we had to waste an option on Raburn, not to mention it’s grossly unfair to him after having made the team again. Nobody should have to carry 13 pitchers, and this falls again on the starters. Sure, I know it’s only the first week, but these guys have a history of having trouble getting past six innings. That simply won’t do. JL probably pulled Miner after one inning on Friday because he knew he’d need him the next day, which he did. I think Miner is one of the stronger pitchers out there, and not likely to suffer a total meltdown. Bautista I think will work out fine. I’ve never had much problem with Jonesie, a distinct minority I inhabit. :-) But yep, we need to get someone new, because Rodney won’t be back until Zumaya is. Until that happens, perhaps Aaron Fultz can be of some help.
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About this blog site, I can offer one suggestion. I’ve also been typing a comment only to have the page suddenly go to “website not found” or some such nonsense. I’ve found that hitting the back button on the browser returns me to my unfinished comment. I’m assuming that all that garbage loading is causing the problem. I’ve rarely seen an upgrade result in such a negative impact. Since the blogs are free, I’m considering signing up for one with the sole purpose to see if there’s any useful information to be had. Just have to find the time to mess with it.
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–Rich

May I comment on the main subject of this blog thread? The reason not many teams have made the postseason after starting 0-4 or 0-5 is that most teams as talented as the Tigers don’t start out that badly. We’re talking the 2003 Tigers, the old Phillies and A’s teams, the Boston Braves, etc. I don’t see as how that stat says anything about what will happen this season. It’s just an interesting stat, that’s all. I’ve seen folks freaking out over this.
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–Rich

yeah i dont care for the ‘improved’ blog system… blogs on sites like scout.com are free, and they have a fantastic system, emoticons, bold, underline, quote, etc….. shrug.
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i also think the tigers will win today, i think verlander is going to go out there and just overpower chisox out of the simple need to win. so… go tigers. get that first win and take the burdon off your collective shoulders.
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mike

Well tonight’s lineup is certainly unorthodox. Too bad it is being presented before a ntaional TV audience IMO.
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If they are going to bench Polanco then I don’t see the problem in batting Santiago either 1st or 2nd.
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Pudge as a leadoff and Thames!!?? batting 2nd baffles me.
I guess we are in a situation wehre JL may be thinking that he wants to get Thamse as many ABs against Buehrle as possible and also there is an element of shaking things up here too.
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The answers will be self evident when the walking wounded come up to bat. Sheffield needs to get over his physical imperfections and perceived limitations and just hit the darn ball. Cabrera needs to relax. Ordonez needs to take a leadership role and quit being a pasenger on this bus that is swerving on 2 wheels around a mountain pass curve.
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We need a total team victory. One in whaich Verlander performs. We get timely hitting, good base-running, and clutch relief pitching.
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It’s for all good men to come to the aid of their party….
It’s for all good men to come to the aid of their party….
It’s for all good men to come to the aid of their party….
It’s for all good men to come to the aid of their party………

I agree about Santiago. I think he’s a better hitter than he’s given credit for, and he can do things like bunt. And well. However, JL has said all along that he’d use Pudge as leadoff against lefties. The Thames in the two hole thing is that business JL got from LaRussa. I’ve never cared for it much, but it’s not surprising. I suppose a change doesn’t hurt anything at this point.
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–Rich

how bout a stat based on 0-6 teams making it to october………..
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this is insanity, twilight zone, 4th demension, insanity.

I guess I will break the silence here. Bottom of 6 now down by 8!!!
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I’m really upset with Guillen and I would like to just get it off my chest. I thought he blew a DP ball the inning or so before and I mentioned to my wife that I don’t like the way he tries to looks so casual and carefree over at first –like it’s beneath him to be playing such a pedestrian position. He flicks his glove around whenever he catches a throw instead of just ‘accepting” the ball into his mitt.
The ridiculous dropped ball cost the team majorly-not that they wouldn’t have found other ways to continue to look dreadful. Rich would know this better than most of us but IMO he was out of position on that ball that he dropped as well. He had his right foot on the bag and his left foot was in foul territroy–anybody other than Konerko could have run right over top of him.
Anyway–it’s off my chest–and it looks like Aki Lopez is proving he can NOT do the job. throwing that pitch on an 0-2 count is just stupid.

I’m trying to be optimistic. But as I just watched the ChiSox bat around in the 6th, and picture an 0-6 start, I start making mental parallels. During the Season of Infinite Pain (’03), they started 0-11.

I do remember talks all of the past two seasons about whether the Yanks would make the playoffs after stumbling hardcore out of the gates. They still did, so I hang onto the sliver that says we still can.

This is exactly what I had feared. JL has said before that he doesn’t buy into team chemistry as a concept, but you have to believe it is a factor at the moment. I don’t think it’s as the media says: that everyone’s waiting for someone else to step up. The issue appears to be that everyone is trying to be the man, and thus is swinging at pitches they have no business swinging at. The real downer is that, with a $132 mill payroll, you don’t get a learning curve. The goal is to produce wins.

What do we do now? Pray. Call in the priest to exorcise the bats. And hope to Jeebus that there’s no firesale if the bottom falls out.

4th dimension would be “time”…. Somebody better call it. How about Santiago though?

Tonight needs to be the *** chewing night!!! Something needs to be done to wake these guys up.
6 double plays??
very poor effort tonight.
Good luck on tuesday guys

Well guys it was my first game tonight that I actually went to. And obviously it was more than a disappointment, I am down right angry now. Actually left the game early (the first time I have ever done that). But frankly it was cold and I just wasn’t going to sit there any longer. I said if they ground into one more double play that is it I am leaving an low and behold Cabrera grounded into one the next pitch.
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I would be lying if I said I new what the problem was. I guess all you can say is that you win as a team and you lose as a team. Nobody can be let off the hook right now. They all stink, and frankly when Justin gave up that HR to Swisher in the 1st, I got a bad attitude right away and a sinking feeling right away. Everyone was booing them and frankly it was sad to me. I have always been one that has said you don’t boo your guys, no matter whatl. But I am now wondering if these very high paid atheletes were getting what they deserved tonight. They have not given their fans anything to cheer about almost all week.

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Not to mention our seats stink. I specifically asked not to be right on the aisle and we get there and we are right on the aisle. So all the people that strictly go to the game to drink, smoke and go to the bathroom 10 times a game, not to even mention the vendors. I get to look at the back of their heads and butts all night. I was told that we were half way in on the row and in fact we are not. It will certianly be a frustrating year in those seats. Not happy with the ticketing agent who sold me a bill of goods.

Well, this has gone from a poor start into the realm of the bizarre. It’s that very thing that actually makes this easier to bear. So, let’s let these guys get out on the road and see what happens. Maybe it’s for the best if we become somewhat of an underdog for awhile. For the time being, I’m just going to try and enjoy watching some baseball after a long winter.
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I’m not going to make any friends with this but here it is anyway. The only thing that bothered me tonight was the behavior of our “fans.” All you yahoos who think it’s fun to boo your OWN TEAM, cut it out! You think that helps anything? Go back to your pre-2006 existence. It sounded like a game in Philadelphia or New York, but it sure didn’t sound like DETROIT. That was disgusting.
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–Rich

Rich, I concur with you whole-heartedly. Detroit fans are (should be) classier than that.

I agree 100%. Why is it that the team only gets the support when they are doing good. They need our support now, more than ever. A day off will do everyone some good! Lets hope for a win on Tuesday! We need to start seeing some smile on our end!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I totally agree with the comments about the fans, we went to the game tonight and the way the fans were acting was ridiculous ; the booing , the comments, it made me sick. Nobody likes to lose but 6 games out of 162, come on ! It seems like going to the games has become a outdoor bar, more people there to get wasted then to be into the game. MAybe people should get off the bandwagon and save some seats for those who have been paying fans for 20+ years or go to New York. The hitting will start, hopefully watching boston get their rings will light a fire.

Don’t get me wrong I didn’t boo and would never boo and I don’t like it when people do. I showed my dissatisfaction of the effort by just leaving the game. However I forked out $20 for parking, $50 in tickets, we shared a beer for $8.00 and I spent $20 at the gift shop. So all in all last night cost me $98.00, and I was not entertained. And I guess I am at the low end on the spending ladder.
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And like I have said before if they lose but they play with maximum effort, I am okay with that, but I can guarentee you this most of the men out on that field did not play anywhere close to that. And I suppose some people there don’t know how to express their dissatisfaction any other way. Believe me I work with the public on a daily basis and have to put up with a very rude people who lie to you and try to cheat you and yell at you. And while I don’t boo, I think that these men can and should be able to take it.

As you all know, I am in Cleveland..so I was excited to hear that the Detroit games were going to be on ESPN on Sat & Sun. Unfortunately, I had to watch a team that doesn’t look like they have any heart. Not that I ever would with the Tigers, but this is the reason (and yes, I know it’s early in the season, blah blah) I wrote off the Lions 3 years ago and haven’t watch a game since. Someone, I don’t care if it is JL or a player needs to be fired up in the dugout and get on these guys. The only reaction I have seen so far was from Willis when his lead got blown.

As far as the booing…I don’t really think it is someone that should be done. BUT, these are grown men out there. They know what their jobs are and should do them. They should be held accountable by the fans. It is alittle different, but when I mess up at work I have my director all over me. I think it is similiar in the Tigers relm as well. The fans should be able to show they aren’t happy and aren’t going to take a bunch of guys on the field just half-***-ing it.

I know it is a long season and we will more than likely right the ship in the coming week (hopefully, with the teams we have to play) but the players should feel embarrassed by the way they are playing, as am I.

Anyway, I will stick with them through thick and thin no matter what happens this season. GO TIGERS!

These numbers say it all:
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Hitting Stats…….AL RANK……..MLB RANK
Runs…….14th……………28th
AVG……..10th……………19th
HR……….12th……………23rd
HITS…….7th……………..16th
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Pitching Stat…….AL RANK………MLB RANK
ERA……14th …………..27th
RUNS….14th…………..29th
ERUNS..14th………….28th
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Those numbers speak volumes. Last or almost last in all catagories. It is no wonder they cant win a game. One of my favorite lines from a movie, and I think that it describes them completely. It is from Bull Durham. “You lolligag around the infield, you lolligag around the outfield, What are you Lolligagers.” Come on Tigers please get it together. Those numbers up there have got to change drastically if you plan on doing anything this summer.

If it’s stats, then look at

27th in MLB, BA w/ RISP – .149, and 1st in MLB, hitting into doubleplays – 11
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I find it strange that Leyland said he sees no cohesiveness, even in batting practice, yet this is the same guy who always says “give me talent over chemistry everytime.” Sparky would be proud of that one.
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We’ve had a weeklong experiment in seeing how it feels to be the Yankees. How’d you like it? Now perhaps we can become an underdog again and we can enjoy the scrap back into contention.
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Todd Jones has some theories on big contracts at http://www.sportingnews.com/yourturn/viewtopic.php?t=395583
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–Rich

Meanwhile, down on the (supposedly depleted) farm:

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Erie is 4-0
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Toledo is 3-1
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Maybe JL can swap rosters for a few days!!!

The worst thing about being 0-6 is the fact that if it can happen at this time of the year it can happen again. Being they have played less than 5% of their schedule also means that such an absurdly awful start can be surmounted. What will be a big factor here is if the club loses belief in themselves. IMO this has always been one of the vulnerabilites of the Tigers (as we know them the last few years), and we all have had times where we were unsure of their ability to rebound and persevere. Their mettle is being tested.

I have to agree with Ty on the booing. I was at the game last night, and the boos did not seem out of line in context. It was like a giant release of frustration and disappointment that we are all feeling right now. It’s not just that we have lost the first 6 games, it’s that as a team, we look lifeless and pathetic.

To compare the scene to New York, I don’t think is fair. When fans boo an individual, like ARod in NY or Grilli, I think it is in really poor taste- but the game last night deserved a big thumbs down.

Jason? Where are you? No blog since Friday? I would be very interested in your take on what is happening. And what may be done to correct the problem. All of the above posters have some good ideas but you are closer to the situation than any of them. Why are our Tigers looking so lifeless? Maybe they would not be 6-0, but they can’t miss Granderson, Zumaya, Rodney, and Wilson to the tune of 0-6. Does Leyland need another response like the one in Cleveland 2 years ago?

k well i have a quick question thats bugging me as of late…. maybe someone can answer….
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when the tigers take batting practice, are they facing ‘live’ pitching, like from JV, KR, NR, DW, or JB? or is it the pitching coach throwing lobs softball style at them?
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if its the latter, i think that should change, give the pitching staff more opportunity to hone in their respective pitches, and the batters an opp. to see different looks and different reads from pitchers…. i’ve always wondered this. maybe someone knows.
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-mike

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